hockeyhof

Is Jean Beliveau one of the Top 3 Greatest Centres of All Time?

Jean Beliveau is one of the rare NHL stars to combine regular season dominance with playoff dominance. Many of the centres who have scored more regular season points than Beliveau both haven’t done so relative to the league – Beliveau would have been the best offensive player of his era had it not been for Gordie Howe – and very few of them have Beliveau’s long history of success in the playoffs.

So where does he rank all time? Is he a Top 5 Centre? Is he a top 5 Player?

Listen to us discuss Jean Beliveau’s career here:

Does Reginald Hooley Smith Belong in the Hockey Hall of Fame?

The Montreal Gazette, p. 17, accessed via Google, Public domain, via Wikimedia Commons

Hooley Smith was one of those skaters who played multiple positions, because back then skaters did that a lot more. We think he was primarily a Centre or a RW, though he supposed to have played D at times.

Smith doesn’t have a lot of accomplishments, though he was among the best passers of his era. But he was an amateur star – winning an Allan Cup and just dominating on his way to an Olympic Gold – and won a few Cups.

He has a fairly mixed case and we’re not quite sure what to do. So listen to us talk about Hooley Smith’s Hall of Fame case here:

Does Bernie “Boom Boom” Geoffrion Belong in the Hockey Hall of Fame?

Bernie “Boom Boom” Geoffrion is one of the underrated great RWs in NHL history. Is he one of the greatest RWs of all time? Would he be better known had he not played for the Canadiens?

Listen to us talk about Geoffrion’s Hall of Fame case here:

Hall of Fame Class of 1972 Part 1: Bernie Geoffrion, Hap Holmes, Hooley Smith

Bernie Geoffrion’s Career:

NHL: 1950-64, 1966-68; 16 seasons, 14 quality
Totals:
- 393G (3rd All Time at his first retirement – Howe, Richard),
- 429A (12th All Time at his first retirement) for
- 822P (5th All Time at his first retirement – Howe, Richard, Lindsay, Beliveau),
- +39* in
- 883 Games;
- 97.5 Point Shares (12th All Time at his first retirement);
- At his 1st retirement, Geoffrion was
  - 12th All time in Offensive Point Shares
  - 21st Forward All Time in Defensive Point Shares
Per Game: At his first retirement, Geoffrion was
- T-8th All Time in GPG
- 9th All Time in APG
- T-5th All Time in PPG (Beliveau, Howe, Bathgate, Cowley)
Era: Of the 19 skaters to play in at least 738 games between 1950 and 1964, Geoffrion is
- 2nd in Goals (behind Howe by 125)
- 2nd in GPG (6 qualifying players)
- 6th in Assists
- T-2nd in APG (7 qualifying players)
- 2nd in Points (behind by Howe by 355)
- 2nd in PPG (5 qualifying players)
- 6th in Plus/Minus
- 14th in Games
- 2nd in Offensive Point Shares (behind Howe by 44.9)
- 3rd Forward in Defensive Point Shares
- 4th in Point Shares
- 14th in Games
82-game average: 37G, 40A for 76P, +4*
3-year peak (1958-61): 70-game average of 39G, 50A for 89P, +5*
Playoffs:
- 58G (3rd All Time at his first retirement – Richard, Howe),
- 60A (3rd All Time at his first retirement – Howe, Harvey) for
- 118P (3rd All Time at his first retirement – Howe, Richard),
- +3* (t-21st All Time at his 1st retirement) in
- 132 Games (5th All Time at his 1st retirement – Kelly, Richard, Howe, Harvey)
- Per Game: At his first retirement, Geoffrion was
  - T-6th All Time in playoff GPG
  - 13th All Time in playoff APG
  - 5th All Time in playoff PPG (Beliveau, Blake, Howe, Richard)
- Era: Of the 13 skaters to play in at least 82 playoff games between 1950 and 1964, Geoffrion is
  - 1st in playoff Goals
  - 4th in playoff GPG
  - 2nd in playoff Assists
  - 6th (3rd last among qualifying players) in playoff APG
  - 2nd in playoff Points
  - 3rd in playoff PPG
  - T-4th in playoff Plus/Minus
  - 1st in playoff Games
Adjustment for era:
- Hockey-Reference:
  - 464G
  - 518A for
  - 982P
  - Adjusted 82-game average: 43G, 48A for 91P (+15P per 82 games)
  - Per Game: Geoffrion is
    - T-22nd All Time in Adjusted GPG;
    - If the qualifier is set to 820 games, Geoffrion is
      - T-6th All Time in Adjusted GPG
      - 14th All Time in Adjusted PPG
- VsX:
  - 595G
  - 696A
  - 1093
  - Per Game: Geoffrion is
    - 19th All Time in VsX Adjusted GPG;
    - If the qualifier is set to 820 games, Geoffrion is
      - 3rd All Time in VsX Adjusted GPG (Richard, Bobby Hull)
      - 17th All Time in VsX Adjusted APG
      - 9th All time in VsX Adjusted PPG
Waived at 34 so he could unretire

Bernie Geoffrion’s Accomplishments:

Hart (‘61)
Art Ross (‘55, ‘61)
Richard* (‘55, ‘61)
Calder (‘52)
Back Check MVP and Best Player (‘61)
All Star:
- 1st Team All Star once
- 2nd Team All Star twice
- 11 All Star Game appearances
Top Player:
- Top 5 Player (by PS) twice (‘55, ‘61)
- Top 10 four times (‘52, ‘60)
- Best Offensive Player (by OPS) once (‘61)
- Top 5 six times (‘52, ‘54, ‘55, ‘56, ‘60)
- Top 10 eight times (‘58, ‘59)
Goals:
- Leader-boards:
  - Led the league in Goals twice
  - Top 5 six times
  - Top 10 eight times
- GPG leader-boards:
  - Led the league in GPG three times (t-8th most all time)
  - Top 5 eight times (t-8th most all time)
  - Top 10 eleven times (t-7th most all time)
- Single-season totals:
  - 50 goals once (2nd player ever, 1 of only 3 at his first retirement – Richard, Hull)
  - 35 goals twice (1 of only 10 players ever at his first retirement)
  - 30 goals four times (1 of only 7 players ever at his first retirement)
  - 25 goals seven times (1 of only 6 players ever at his first retirement)
  - 20 goals twelve times (1 of only 3 players ever at his first retirement – Howe, Richard)
Assists:
- Leader-boards:
  - Top 10 five times
- APG leader-boards:
  - Top 5 three times
  - Top 10 six times
- Single-season totals:
  - 40 assists three times (1 of only 11 players ever at his first retirement)
Points:
- Leader-boards:
  - Led the league in Points twice (t-10th most all time)
  - Top 5 three times
  - Top 10 seven times
- PPG leader-boards:
  - Led the league in PPG once
  - Top 5 seven times
  - Top 10 nine times (t-8th most all time)
- Single-season totals:
  - 90 points once (1 of only 4 players ever at his first retirement – Beliveau, Moore, Howe)
  - 70 points three times (1 of only 10 players ever at his first retirement)
  - 60 points five times (1 of only 6 players ever at his first retirement)
  - 50 points nine times (1 of only 6 players ever at his first retirement)
VsX Peak:
- Best 7 Seasons:
  - Goals: 14th All Time
  - Assists: 67th All Time
  - Points: 39th All Time
- Best 10 Seasons:
  - Goals: 14th All Time
  - Assists: 84th All Time
  - Points: 42nd All Time

Bernie Geoffrion’s Great Teams:

Best Player (led playoffs in goals and points) on one Champion (‘57 Canadiens)
Best Player on one Champion (‘53 Canadiens)
Best Skater? On one Runner Up (‘55 Canadiens)
Top 3 Forward (led playoffs in goals) on one Runner Up (‘54 Canadiens)
Top 3 Forward (led playoffs in assists, co-led playoffs in points) on one Champion (‘60 Canadiens)
Top 3 Forward (by points) on three Champions (‘56,’58, ‘59 Canadiens) and one Final Four (‘67 Rangers)
Top 6 Forward (by points) on one Runner Up (‘52 Canadiens) on two Final Four (‘63, ‘64 Canadiens)
Top 9 Player (by points) on one Runner Up (‘51 Canadiens) and one Final Four (‘61 Canadiens)
Role Player? (by points) on one Final Four (‘62 Canadiens)

Does Billy Burch Belong in the Hockey Hall of Fame?

The Winnipeg Tribune, Dec. 24, 1923 (pg. 13), Public domain, via Wikimedia Commons

Billy Burch won the Hart in a year when he was the 3rd best offensive player on his own team and the 6th best overall. That’s basically his only case for Hall of Fame inclusion.

But what if he did something else?

Listen to us talk about Billy Burch’s Hall of Fame case here:

Does Gordie Drillon Belong in the Hockey Hall of Fame?

Hockey publicity photo c 1940(Life time: pre-1949, copyright expired), Public domain, via Wikimedia Commons

Did you know that Gordie Drillon was one of the greatest goal scorers in early NHL history?

He was indeed. And we think he has a pretty slam dunk Hall of Fame case. Listen to us talk about him here:

Does Irvine Ace Bailey Belong in the Hockey Hall of Fame?

Ace Bailey was briefly the best forward in the league. But he had only really great year and three good years. And he didn’t perform well in the playoffs

Listen to us talk about Ace Bailey’s Hall of Fame case:

Is Bobby Orr the Greatest Hockey Player of All Time?

Djcz, CC BY-SA 3.0 https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0, via Wikimedia Commons

There is a never-ending debate among hockey fans as to which player of Gretzky, Lemieux and Orr was the greatest. There are certain areas where each stands supreme.

Our vote is for Orr because we think he played the more difficult and more important position and because he revolutionized the position as well. (Also, the skating.) But at least one of us thinks there’s room for debate.

Listen to us talk about Bobby Orr:

Is Bobby Hull the Greatest Left Wing of All Time?

Many 21st century hockey fans likely think the answer to the question “Who is the Greatest Left Winger of All Time?” has an easy answer, Alex Ovechkin.

But it’s possible we don’t remember how dominant Bobby Hull truly was. Hull won 2 Hart trophies and 3 Art Ross trophies. But he was a Hart finalist for most of a decade. Additionally, he was, by most standards, the best offensive player of his era, both in the regular season and, crucially, in the playoffs.

And then he went to another league and dominated it in his late 30s. (It’s possible his departure to the WHA colours how we think of his career.)

So, is Bobby Hull the Greatest LW of All Time? Listen here:

Is Stan Mikita a Top 5 Centre All Time?

If you didn’t see him play, it’s possible Stan Mikita’s resume is better than you think it should be. In addition to winning multiple Hart trophies, Art Ross trophies and the Stanley Cup, he’s likely the 2nd best centre of the ’60s and among the best centres of the ’70s.

So it’s clear Stan Mikita belongs in the Hockey Hall of Fame. The question is, where does Stan Mikita rank among centres all time?

Listen here:

Is Phil Esposito one of the Greatest Centres of All Time?

Boston Bruins, Public domain, via Wikimedia Commons

Why is it that we (our generation anyway) have trouble thinking of Esposito as one of the greatest hockey players of all time? Is it because he was on the same team as Bobby Orr, whose legend has endured far better? Is it because of Esposito’s extraordinarily unathletic physique? Is it because everything he did has since been done multiple times by multiple players so those records feel less important?

We have no idea, but Espo was the most dominant offensive player between Howe and Gretzky. (We read somewhere that Lafleur was the most dominant offensive player between Howe and Gretzky, but we don’t see evidence to back that up.)

Sure, Espo benefited from playing more games per season in the newly expanded league (someone was going to set records) and, yes, he benefited from playing with the Greatest of All Time, but lesser players wouldn’t have excelled the way he did, over such a long period of time.

Listen to us talk about Esposito here: